Elitist Jerks Weekly Recap 9/23/11

Every Friday Tabana brings you the latest discussions straight from the Elitist Jerks forums with a recap of what was discussed and links to the full posts so you can stay on top of the latest in hunter theorycrafting.


Arcane Shot vs. Kill Command for the Tier 12 Four-piece Bonus Proc

In the Marksmanship thread, Sexmir quoted a section of the guide where the use of Arcane Shot vs. Kill Command to consume the Tier 12 Four-piece Bonus Proc is discussed. Sexmir asked if Wild Quiver could proc from Kill Command.

Whitefyst replied that “since KC is not a ranged attack, it does not proc Wild Quiver.”

With a very high 33% mastery, the expected average benefit of a WQ proc is not near enough to span the DPS difference between KC and AS. Using my hunter, using KC instead of AS on T12 4-set procs is a 1030 dmg benefit, but that does not include the benefit of a possible Sic’Em proc.

Looking at the data with my current gear, on average using KC or AS seems to be about a draw and preferrential. The factors that should be weighed when deciding which to use include:

  • High mastery favors using AS while low mastery favors KC
  • Having pet talented with 2/2 WH favors using AS to get the possible Sic’Em proc while being talented 1/2 WH generally favors KC.
  • Being an Orc with bonus pet damage favors KC while not being an orc favors AS (my data is as an Orc)

Construkt said “Don’t forget that using KC does not interrupt your 2 sequential steady shots for the ISS buff. So if you use KC as a proc burner (which I often do), you can go ss > kc > ss and still get the buff, since the attack is coming from your pet and not you.

Whitefyst replied:

This […] can potentially be beneficial for some people; however, practically speaking, I do not think it is really worthwhile for most folks to interrupt their SS pair cast to try to squeeze in a KC to utilize a T12 4-set proc that has occurred since after they started casting the first SS of the pair. It really has little to no benefit in most cases and can actually result in a DPS loss in other cases if used poorly.

Whitefyst produced an analysis and concluded “until your SS casts are GCD limited, […] there is a constant 6.9% chance for a T12 4-set proc. Once your SS cast becomes GCD limited, then the chance for an extra autoshot and resulting T12 4-set proc to occur increases to […] 9%.”

Now you may think that a 7% to 9% chance to get an extra T12 4-set may be very beneficial, and that may be true, but you have to put the occurrences of these cases into context of an actual fight. Thus, you need to account for the following:

  1. KC is only a possible option to utilize the T12 4-set proc in place of our regular focus dump when that focus dump is AS. When our focus dump is AI, we do not want to be wasting the proc on lower damage, lower focus costing, and no secondary benefits KC over higher damage, higher focus costing, and secondary benefits AI. […]
  2. Ignore the high haste cases in the table where your SS is GCD capped and the chance for the extra T12 4-set proc is higher. These are all cases where we would usually be using AI as our focus dump […] Thus, the constant 6.9% chance is what is applicable.
  3. Assuming a balanced AS focus dump CS cycle […], the option to squeeze in a KC between SSs is not beneficial in all cases. It is a decent option over the first SS pair where the remaining part of the cycle can be adjusted, but it is not a decent option over the second SS pair since it would result in pushing your CS cast back a GCD and using the T12 4-set proc on KC instead of the better option of CS. Thus, this reduces the number of beneficial occurrences down by half. […]
  4. Between MMM AI procs and T12 4-set procs and current haste levels, our focus should already be well balanced on an AS focus-dump cycle. […] The only possible benefit to the situation is the damage benefit of replacing of an AS with a KC, which the previous post stated is currently pretty much a push as best.

Sexmir said “I can’t see a significant difference in the damage amount of KC and AS. AS crits for round about 22k and KC for 23k.”

Whitefyst agreed “Yes, I came to that conclusion, but being an orc skews the data for a little larger KC for me.”

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Bloodlust Timing

In the Best Possible DPS thread, KaneParker7 noted that the MM Aimed Profile and the MM Arcane profile use  Bloodlust (Ancient Hysteria, Heroism, Time Warp) at different percentages into the fight:

This cool down needs to be kept the same over both profiles, to make it the most accurate that it can be between the two simulations. […] I propose that you add “% of time into the fight to use Heroism/Bloodlust/Time Warp” into the table at the beginning of the thread, so that all of the testing is done on a level playing field.

Eurytos replied that the timing of Bloodlust does not need to be kept static and can be adjusted to whatever best suits each profile:

Bloodlust timing is often debated and seeing when is the best time to use it is one of the great things about an analysis like that. Is it better to use it early on when it can better coincide with other cooldowns? Or is it better to use in Termination/Kill Shot range? This can tell you.

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Effects of Latency

In the Best Possible DPS thread, Neith made note of the adverse effects latency has on DPS achieved with the various templates:

For example […] I am playing from SEA region and have a ping of around 300. The following will happen with 300 ms added into the FD settings:

  • Best MM (Hard Aimed):
    • DPS: 40539.81 change of -1128.41
  • Best MM (Arcane Shot):
    • DPS: 39922.19 change of -1290.62
  • Best BM:
    • DPS: 37236.86 change of -2854.74
  • Best Survival:
    • DPS: 36035.41 change of -2305.83

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Encounters Not Yet Soloed?

In the Soloing Old Instances for Fun and Profit thread, Bovii asked which encounters had not yet been soloed by hunters.

Onin linked Durendil’s lists of raid encounters soloed by hunters and said:

Out of them I think Sarth 2D and 3D would be the most plausible encounters. Then there’s 25mans and Heroic difficulties of Naxx and Ulduar, maybe even ICC. I guess Northrend Beasts is implausible (goddamn kobolds) but Jarraxus shouldn’t be difficult?

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Eredar Twins and M’uru in Sunwell Plateau

In the Soloing Old Instances for Fun and Profit thread, Itzaic reported downing both the Eredar Twins and M’uru. Hunters have now soloed all of Sunwell Plateau aside from Kalecgos, who can be avoided. This is significant because it opens the possibility for hunters to solo farm the legendary bow: Thori’dal, the Star’s Fury. (See our WHH recap: Solo Farming for Thori’dal, the Stars’ Fury.)

Eredar Twins

For the twins, as long as you stay out of blaze patches and feign death conflagration your health will be fine for most of the fight. I killed Alythess first to remove the flame buffet from the rest of the fight. After she’s dead, Sacrolash will cast conflagration faster than your feign death comes off cooldown. Roar of Sacrifice those you can’t feign to reduce the damage.

See a video of the kill at Eredar Twins – Hunter Solo


M’uru is even worse. You have to split your time between DPSing the adds and him. Otherwise your pet will be overwhelmed, or you never get DPS time on M’uru himself. I misdirect all of the humanoid adds to my pet in the back of the room, and only start DPSing them when a void sentinel is active. Kill the void sentinel to spawn little void spawns and AoE the pack of adds until most of them are dead. Your pet can finish off any others you have left. For the dark fiends, you can feign death to despawn them if you wait until they start to follow you. Phase 2 is simply stay away from black holes and dark fiends.

See a video of the kill at M’uru – Hunter solo

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Assembly of Iron (medium mode) in Ulduar

In the Soloing Old Instances for Fun and Profit thread, Durendil announced soloing the Assembly of Iron (medium mode) in Ulduar.

Pet switches are a nightmare: you put your pet on Molgeim after dispelling his shield, mend pet, FD, and when you get up… Bam! He aggros you. And you want all your health for Phase 2.
Last strategy I used was pet on Molgeim, misdirect Steelbreaker. Then misdirect Molgeim as soon as I get up. And hope Steelbreaker doesn’t go on hunter-aggroing mode. With luck and RNG you can kill Steelbreaker with 3 or even 2 pets, which is lucky because because pet switches are EVIL.

I sadly lost my video because of an electricity problem, so I only have a screenshot: ImageShack – Online Photo.

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Auriaya and Mimiron (10-player normal) in Ulduar

In the Soloing Old Instances for Fun and Profit thread, Goldschakal posted that Auriaya and Mimiron had been soloed.


For Auriaya, the pet tanks the boss while the two sentries are quickly killed. Use Multi-Shot to kill the Swarming Guardians. Feign Death and Disengage are useful when the Feral Defender spawns. Use bandages when the Feral Defender is dead and Terrifying Screech is on cooldown. Interrupt Sentinel Blast with Silencing Shot. Stand behind Auriaya to avoid damage from Sonic Screech.

Screenshot of Goldschakal’s Auriaya kill.


Mimiron is a four-phase fight:

  1. Phase One is a tank and spank phase and should end after the fourth Shock Blast.
  2. For Phase Two, summon a damage pet and move in circles around the boss using Aspect of the Fox to avoid damage from Rapid Burst and Heat Wave. Dodge the Laser Barrage and Rocket Strikes.
  3. Stand at the entrance for phase three. Summon a tanking pet and attack the head using Misdirection. Ignore the Bomb Bots but send your pet to attack the Assault Bots and Junk Bots. Use Feign Death if a second or third Assault Bot spawns. When the head is at 40%, kill the Assault Bot and use the Magnetic Core then finish off the head.
  4. Phase four is another tank and spank phase. Dodge Rocket Strikes and Laser Barrage and remember to kill all three parts within 15 seconds of each other.

Screenshot of Goldschakal’s Mimiron kill

Durendil also downed Mimiron this week and provided a video of the kill: Durendil vs. Mimiron

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Kologarn (10-player) in Ulduar

In the Soloing Old Instances for Fun and Profit thread, Durendil stated that Kologarn was down:

This fight is all about randomness. I used the same strategy for 2 hours until it paid off. What I did was stand on the line that marks the entrance to Kologarn’s room, use an aimed shot (no misdirection) and then send my pet. I had deactivated growl to stay first in aggro.

I have no real idea of why stone grip works some times and not other times. I believe that if he casts stone grip while he’s targeting your pet, you are gripped, and if he is trying to hit you, you aren’t. But I remember times when stone grip failed and my pet was first in aggro… weird.

See Durendil’s video of the kill at Durendil vs. Kologarn

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Toravon the Ice Watcher in the Vault of Archavon

In the Soloing Old Instances for Fun and Profit thread, Itzaic reported soloing Toravon the Ice Watcher, completing the Vault of Archavon solos.

The only thing that can kill your pet is Frostbite stacks building up. Since I couldn’t Distracting Shot Toravon, what I did was either dismiss my pet or despawn my pet through outranging. Recall your pet immediately so Frostbite can slowly tick off. While all this is happening you need to be moving constantly to keep away from Toravon: Disengage + Aspect of the Cheetah works fine for this. Misdirect your pet at any moment when it’s been recalled. When Frostbite is about to fall off Feign Death so that he’ll go back to your pet.

If you didn’t misdirect or your pet didn’t hit him, he’ll just despawn so be careful.

See a video of the kill: Toravon the Ice Watcher – Hunter Solo

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Yogg-Saron in Ulduar: Two Lights in the Darkness

In the Soloing Old Instances for Fun and Profit thread, Zhinq announced soloing Yogg-Saron with two Keepers active for the achievement: Two Lights in the Darkness.

See a video of the kill in our WHH recap.

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Yogg-Saron in Ulduar: One Light in the Darkness

Zhinq then went on to solo Yogg-Saron with only one Keeper active for the achievement: One Light in the Darkness.

See a video of the kill.

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A full index of all Elitist Jerks posts recapped at the Wow Hunter’s Hall is maintained in the Index of Elitist Jerks Hunter Forum Posts.

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